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Axl and Slash "not on great terms", will do no interviews or be photographed together

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They've probably got a big curtain with "Technical Difficulties, Please Stand By" written on it just for that occasion.

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Knowing our luck, Axl will show up looking lean and mean and sounding better than ever...and Slash and Duff turn up fat, wasted and have turned Frank into a heroin addict  :lol:

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 there is a world's full of difference between patching up a friendship, patching up a working relationship, and just willing to be civil enough to work together for the sake of a big payday.

As time has gone by and we are not hearing much of a peep of anything, the more I'm thinking this thread's topic is closer to the truth than not.

I now pretty much believe Axl is doing with 100% rolling eyes, and being pissed with himself its even come to this.

Agreed. I was hoping it would be similar to the Soundgarden reunion. Its starting to sound closer to the Eagles situation. The world will get its iconic moment of Axl and Slash onstage together, no matter what happens afterwards, it will be in every "best of 2016" magazine/internet article...but other than that....this hybrid/regrouping/whatever will just go city to city busting out the hits. There's nothing wrong with that but IMO hardcore fans may need to adjust their expectations a bit. I'd love to finally see some official band pics/promo not from 1991 but its not looking likely.

 

If we don't get any band pictures to help promote GNR and the tour in the next few weeks or accompanying all the tour dates being announced, IMO we're never getting any.

 

I'm doing my best to stay on the positive side as we could be in for a killer ride the next couple years....but so much hinges on these first shows(Vegas, Coachella).

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I now pretty much believe Axl is doing with 100% rolling eyes, and being pissed with himself its even come to this.

It was his last option. Another Chinese reboot to play the hits wasn't going to work. It was either some form of reunion or retire.

 

I'm glad he chose to continue. It means something might come out of this. 2009-14 was a complete waste IMO...even if fans enjoyed those shows. No material whatsoever in that five year period. Now GNR and the label have an incentive to actually start considering releasing either an album, single, or diving into the vault for some box sets, DVDs,etc.

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I think you need to ask yourself this.

On April 8th, what are the chances during a break between one of the first few songs, Axl mentions Slash and how great it is to be back with him.

The place would EXPLODE. The cheers would be deafening.

And I don't think there is even a 1% chance that would happen.

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Never understood why some fans actually want rants. In the early days...maybe. They were young, rebels, etc.  Rants in the CD era? Vomit inducing.

 

This here....

 

 

Is extremely pathetic yet some fans used to quote it, place it in their sigs, and act like it was a highlight of his career.

 

The tour derailed pretty much right after he said that crap and he disappeared for four years. Watching it now and its even worse. He's got a killer lineup onstage just having to stand there and listen to Axl throwing a hissy fit over a bunch of ex members who have already moved on with their lives.

 

Love how he says he "doesn't give a fuck". Well if you don't give a fuck....why do you keep harping on these people you don't give a fuck about?

 

"I'm not trying to bum anybody out". Really?  Then how about busting out another new song(maybe IRS) instead of talking about Slash because absolutely zero people in the venue bought tickets to hear about him.

 

When he said years later that this tour was a mistake and he was pretty much forced to do it, it makes sense. He is in no state of mind to be touring with that lineup when all he can think about is Slash, Duff, and Izzy.

 

His exaggerations about fans/media shitting on his 'new' band and blaming them for no reunion is laughable. There was genuine interest in Chinese Democracy at the time. Hell, Rolling Stone and Spin were practically deep throating the new material when he unveiled it in 2001.....yet there's this supposed vast media conspiracy against it. Saying we had been manipulated was also laughable. I don't consider a handful of comments from ex members over the last seven years to be manipulation. I considered it simply them answering questions being asked in interviews.

 

I did like the part where he's mocking people and includes the "they wont put a record out" comments. He did this several times on this tour.....like anyone in the crowd needed a reminder that they didn't have an album out.

 

There's a lot of 'projecting' in those rants from that tour.

 

 

If he was going to continually rant about anything on that tour it should've been how the label was cluster fucking the project. At least he would've been discussing current events.

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All propaganda has to be popular and has to accommodate itself to the comprehension of the least intelligent of those whom it seeks to reach.

 

 

Demoralize the enemy from within by surprise, terror, sabotage, assassination. This is the war of the future.

 

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Slash, Duff, Fortus and Frank will put on an extremely corporate, rehearsed, choreographed "energetic" performance that doesn't vary one bit from show to show. The cameras will be mostly focused on those four. Axl will basically just show up and give minimal effort. Just enough to get by. There will be backing tracks.

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Never understood why some fans actually want rants. In the early days...maybe. They were young, rebels, etc. Rants in the CD era? Vomit inducing.

This here....

Is extremely pathetic yet some fans used to quote it, place it in their sigs, and act like it was a highlight of his career.

The tour derailed pretty much right after he said that crap and he disappeared for four years. Watching it now and its even worse. He's got a killer lineup onstage just having to stand there and listen to Axl throwing a hissy fit over a bunch of ex members who have already moved on with their lives.

Love how he says he "doesn't give a fuck". Well if you don't give a fuck....why do you keep harping on these people you don't give a fuck about?

"I'm not trying to bum anybody out". Really? Then how about busting out another new song(maybe IRS) instead of talking about Slash because absolutely zero people in the venue bought tickets to hear about him.

When he said years later that this tour was a mistake and he was pretty much forced to do it, it makes sense. He is in no state of mind to be touring with that lineup when all he can think about is Slash, Duff, and Izzy.

His exaggerations about fans/media shitting on his 'new' band and blaming them for no reunion is laughable. There was genuine interest in Chinese Democracy at the time. Hell, Rolling Stone and Spin were practically deep throating the new material when he unveiled it in 2001.....yet there's this supposed vast media conspiracy against it. Saying we had been manipulated was also laughable. I don't consider a handful of comments from ex members over the last seven years to be manipulation. I considered it simply them answering questions being asked in interviews.

I did like the part where he's mocking people and includes the "they wont put a record out" comments. He did this several times on this tour.....like anyone in the crowd needed a reminder that they didn't have an album out.

There's a lot of 'projecting' in those rants from that tour.

If he was going to continually rant about anything on that tour it should've been how the label was cluster fucking the project. At least he would've been discussing current events.

Brilliant post. Axsel and his fans are pathetic.

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Never understood why some fans actually want rants. In the early days...maybe. They were young, rebels, etc. Rants in the CD era? Vomit inducing.

This here....

Is extremely pathetic yet some fans used to quote it, place it in their sigs, and act like it was a highlight of his career.

The tour derailed pretty much right after he said that crap and he disappeared for four years. Watching it now and its even worse. He's got a killer lineup onstage just having to stand there and listen to Axl throwing a hissy fit over a bunch of ex members who have already moved on with their lives.

Love how he says he "doesn't give a fuck". Well if you don't give a fuck....why do you keep harping on these people you don't give a fuck about?

"I'm not trying to bum anybody out". Really? Then how about busting out another new song(maybe IRS) instead of talking about Slash because absolutely zero people in the venue bought tickets to hear about him.

When he said years later that this tour was a mistake and he was pretty much forced to do it, it makes sense. He is in no state of mind to be touring with that lineup when all he can think about is Slash, Duff, and Izzy.

His exaggerations about fans/media shitting on his 'new' band and blaming them for no reunion is laughable. There was genuine interest in Chinese Democracy at the time. Hell, Rolling Stone and Spin were practically deep throating the new material when he unveiled it in 2001.....yet there's this supposed vast media conspiracy against it. Saying we had been manipulated was also laughable. I don't consider a handful of comments from ex members over the last seven years to be manipulation. I considered it simply them answering questions being asked in interviews.

I did like the part where he's mocking people and includes the "they wont put a record out" comments. He did this several times on this tour.....like anyone in the crowd needed a reminder that they didn't have an album out.

There's a lot of 'projecting' in those rants from that tour.

If he was going to continually rant about anything on that tour it should've been how the label was cluster fucking the project. At least he would've been discussing current events.

Brilliant post. Axsel and his fans are pathetic.

Not as pathetic as his lapdogs and employees.

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I wouldn't go so far as to call Axl a con artist. I think the guy has mental issues but he's just lazy. He's a very lazy musician. I mean, people talk about the 15 year gap between TSI and CD but what about the four year gap between AFD and the Illusions?

I mean, when you break it down, Axl is far from some prolific songwriter or the genius that the media proclaimed him to be in the late 90s. Every GN'R record except AFD has cover tunes; there are probably just as many cover songs in GN'R discography as there are new songs. Okay, maybe a bit of an exaggeration, but for a major artist, it's a lot.

From 1987 to 1991, GN'R released exactly one and a half albums. AFD, and Lies. Lies, which, while great, was half cover tunes (if you include the acoustic redo of You're Crazy). There are some great bands who had their entire career in 4 years, like The Doors, or who put out album after album every year in a four year stretch (think The Stones). Axl was lazy. It wasn't the other guys' fault, they were writing and recording instrumentals for what would become the UYIs as early as '87, '88.

Axl was lazy. 1989 had the potential to be their biggest year, riding the ride of success that SCOM brought them as a single, and again, because of Axl, they sat that entire year out for the most part live. And didn't do shit with that year of any productive value. He basically destroyed the band's sense of brotherhood at Chicago that year...Meanwhile despite it all, Slash and Duff plugged away and wrote new tunes at Chicago.

We get to the '90s and Axl adds Dizzy for some reason and a ton of unneeded vocal effects and weird sounds to many of the songs, like the slurpy sounds in The Garden. I think he was starting to buy into his own press at that point. The guy thinks he's some Freddie Mercury type visionary, but doesn't have half the songwriting credits to back it up. When it comes to CD, the band wrote dozens and dozens of songs that remain unreleased. All of these songs were simply in need of vocal parts and melodies from Rose. That's why Robin quit. As he said in 2000, he got tired of writing instrumental tracks that weren't going anywhere. Axl was too scared, too perfectionist, and ultimately, too lazy to push himself to work at that level. Most of the CD tracks have vocal tracks from 1999 or so - done in one take.

 

As I've gotten older and have come to love true artists like Freddie Mercury, who were devoted to making music for their fans to the very end, I've come to appreciate Axl less and less. Even the Stones, who are in their 70s, manage to put out new songs every few years, which is something Axl seems incapable of doing. He has failed to realize that it is only rock music, not rocket science. He treats it like it's the X-Files!

Axl was a huge part of GN'R's success due to his persona and the realism in the lyrics he actually put out. But a large part of GN'R's success happened in spite of Axl as well, not because of him.

So, a malicious, evil con artist who wakes up every day wondering how he's going to fuck the fans over? No. A pretentious, lazy musician who has delusions of grandeur, but is stymied by his own laziness and insecurities? Yes.

 

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You make some good points but....

 

 

what about the four year gap between AFD and the Illusions?

What about it? In my youth it cetainly felt like an eternity but its not even remotely close to the bat shit crazy CD saga.

 

 

Axl was lazy. 1989 had the potential to be their biggest year, riding the ride of success that SCOM brought them

Technically there was no reason for an album in 1989.  In 1989, radio stations were playing the live version of KOHD at the Marquee like it was a top 10 single. MTV had Patience and Paradise City in constant rotation. They were also still playing the Ritz show regularly, eventually to the point where they turned some of the songs from it into videos themselves.  Axl was on the cover of every music magazine, those few dates with the Stones brought major publicity and controversy, and in the fall there was the surprise performance with Petty at the VMAs and Axl appearing on Henley's End of the Innocence album. Izzy pissing on an airplane was headline news on CNN.

 

The label's promotion of these two albums at the same time and actually placing Lies on the backburner even though its the new album is bizarre in hindsight. Lies could have easily been milked of a couple more singles but no one seemed to care about pushing it. They let it sell itself.

 

They had two albums still selling like hotcakes and a third(LLAS) so in demand it costed 500 bucks if you could find it. Everywhere you looked, people of all ages were wearing GNR shirts to the point where a trip to the mall was basically nothing but staring at walking GNR ads.

 

I was dying for UYI in 1990 as the hype went into overdrive but even then.....an album wasn't truly needed. They were being promoted constantly.  The Farm Aid performance created a massive buzz as well as controversy. By the time that died down....Adler's firing is in the news. Speculation on who they would choose to replace him(which made the speculation on who would replace Bucket in 2006 seem like a popcorn fart) was being promoted everywhere, the hiring of Sorum made waves, and we also saw the release of Civil War and then KOHD from that soundtrack which received constant radio rotation on top 40 and rock radio.

 

Again I ask....where is this need for an album? Fans have two new songs to listen to, have been informed by all the band members that the UYI album has now been turned into a massive project that may wind up being three albums(it wound up being two obviously), and they aren't touring....but as Slash and others have stated...this lack of touring is what caused many of the problems to arise but from a hardcore fan perspective...its beside the point regarding an album.

 

Heading into 1991.....now this is where its time to put up or shut up. The hype for CD pales in comparison to the hype for UYI. Not just band members claiming its amazing(they'd done that for three years). Other people are now hearing it...Sebastian Bach, Alice Cooper(for obvious reasons), several journalists get a listen...its being called two albums of "massive epics" and rock magazines labeling it our generations White album when we've only heard two songs(one we had heard live before) from it.

 

This is when we get a slight glimpse into what would happen in the early years of Chinese Democracy....release dates announced...then pulled...announced again..pulled.....before the tour even started but when the tour got underway.....what a ride.....

 

The riot was a global event. My mom didn't want me to go to my show which was a few weeks after that show....thankfully my dad overruled her.

 

The late starts were being covered as well. Axl ranting about the record label, fans in the crowd,etc. At least we were being treated to incredible set lists that will never be topped. Getting to listen to a UYI heavy set list months before the album's release was a treat. Imagine that Osaka 2009 set list being performed at Rio in 2001....that's basically what we were getting in the summer of 91.

 

The release of UYI was unlike anything I will ever see again. It was the Thriller of the early 90s. Crowds lined up outside record stores at midnight, crowds in front of stores the next morning when the stores opened...don't remember the actual statistic but I think UYI went gold in two hours.

 

 

I think he was starting to buy into his own press at that point.

Absolutely. This started with that RS interview in 89. It also kicked off the hype for what would be known as UYI.

 

 

Axl was too scared, too perfectionist

This perfectionist myth needs to die off. He never was and never will be a perfectionist. Its funny looking back on the mid 00s era of the wait for CD with some fans acting like he's in the studio every day for years on end getting the album just right whipping up a masterpiece  when the reality is that he'd go years without touching the project and at that specific point(2005) hadn't recorded even one single line of vocals since 2001...when he spent a week recording them. Yes....from the years 2000 to 2006.... one week was spent working on vocal takes.

 

While you admit he's lazy, how can you call that being a perfectionist? The album has vocal takes lifted from demos during the Beavan sessions and some of them are bordering on scratch vocals(The Blues, Madagascar, Riad). I love how some fans say he's "intentionally" singing the songs like that because he's so full of emotion.......uh no.....he was just too lazy to rerecord them.

 

 

While we do know he went into a studio in late 2006(or was it 07) to do some minor touch ups, he actually should have spent a few weeks Chris Cornell style and pretty much lived in the studio getting those vocals up to snuff. Its very revealing on how he felt about  the project at that point. Had he not been in deep doo doo with the label...its pretty much a guarantee he would have abandoned the project years before its release. Any fire he had for the project was pretty much gone by 2002.

 

I cant hardly believe not one single person on the forums during those chats asked him why Beltrami's work had been added to Buckmaster's tracks on the album. One worked on songs we had alfready heard and wound up on the album, the other worked on tracks still in the vault yet both of their contributions wound up being layered into the same songs.  It needed an answer and was an elephant in the room he so easily was able to avoid.

 

 

I agree with you that while he's one of my favorite singers and always will be, as more time passes his body of work is lacking when you compare him to the legends. Too much time was wasted on the CD project.

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Most of the good songs on the UYIs were noted to be ready years prior to the release of the albums, including Axl's parts. I don't see how you can pin the blame on Axl or any one person in the band. I think the main reasons for the wait were - 1. so that they could develop shit filler tracks and do the gimmick "double-album" release, and 2. the saturated production process. I think the main issue with those albums, from an objective standpoint, is the inclusion of tremendously awful, shit songs like So Fine and Get in the Ring. Sure, for some hardcore fans, it's better to have more songs than less, no matter how good they are, especially in hindsight considering that these would be the last original songs the classic lineup would release, but the truth remains that the songs are indeed shit and the UYIs would probably be looked at in a similar light to AFD had they trimmed the fat and released one album of only good songs. Imagine if AFD had been released in two parts, with each part being half real AFD songs and half filler shit like hair-metal covers, Shadow of Your Love and Ain't Goin' Down.

Regardless of the four year wait, GNR put out two phenomenal rock albums over that span of time. Unfortunately, one of those two was spread over its own two albums, but they still released two albums worth of top-notch material in two separate intervals.

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Most of the good songs on the UYIs were noted to be ready years prior to the release of the albums, including Axl's parts. I don't see how you can pin the blame on Axl or any one person in the band. I think the main reasons for the wait were - 1. so that they could develop shit filler tracks and do the gimmick "double-album" release, and 2. the saturated production process. I think the main issue with those albums, from an objective standpoint, is the inclusion of tremendously awful, shit songs like So Fine and Get in the Ring. Sure, for some hardcore fans, it's better to have more songs than less, no matter how good they are, especially in hindsight considering that these would be the last original songs the classic lineup would release, but the truth remains that the songs are indeed shit and the UYIs would probably be looked at in a similar light to AFD had they trimmed the fat and released one album of only good songs. Imagine if AFD had been released in two parts, with each part being half real AFD songs and half filler shit like hair-metal covers, Shadow of Your Love and Ain't Goin' Down.

Regardless of the four year wait, GNR put out two phenomenal rock albums over that span of time. Unfortunately, one of those two was spread over its own two albums, but they still released two albums worth of top-notch material in two separate intervals.

My point was though, tons of bands have their entire careers in the time it took GN'R to follow up their debut. As far as "the good songs"....Almost all the songs were finished instrumentally by 1989. Good and bad. The wait wasn't "adding filler", it was waiting for Axl to add lyrics and record vocals. It's always been down to Axl. You can totally blame him because there's demos out there of most of the songs from 1987, 1988, 1989, and 1990. All instrumental. 

As far as the other guy's text...No album is ever "needed" ever. But, compared to other bands, GN'R (Axl) was lazy as shit. In the ten years between 1985 and 1995, GN'R released only three full albums of original material...3 full albums in ten years is very spare. 

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I used to really, really, really love the UYI albums. I was a die hard UYI lineup fan and thought it was the best thing since sliced bread.

In the past few months or so though I've kind of done a 180 on the records. I find them to be, in a lot of places, incredibly corny and dated, and horrible sounding to boot. While both albums have their share of really great songs (YCBM, Bad Obsession, DTJ, Pretty Tied Up, etc), every song is plagued with terrible, very sterile and dated sounding production and mixing; no song is truly 'raw'; every track is polished to precision. Matt's drumming is flat, lacking in groove, and at times even sounds like a drum machine. The guitars lack the unique dynamics of the interplay between Izzy and Slash that recalled the early Rolling Stones, and instead, the guitars on many tracks are compressed and sound like one giant slush (at least, the rhythm parts).

Axl's vocals are incredibly scratchy on most of the record, compared with the perfection that is his voice on Appetite. It's a raspy, broken glass sound rather than the rasp-meets-punk snarl on Appetite for Destruction.

You have good songs that either have a lot of weird effects added to them (the bubble/fart sounds on Garden of Eden), or weird artistic choices (the phone call on KOHD. KOOL RANCH DRESSING, and so on). Unneeded musical instruments which just seem like showboating (banjo on Breakdown, sitar on Pretty Tied Up), which water down those songs.

You don't have any of the groove/loose feel which made AFD special. You don't have any truly anthemic songs outside of YCBM, none of the catchy memorability that every single song on Appetite had.

At this point, I only love Appetite. I think the loss of Adler was the beginning of the end for the band and...If you compare the UYIs to any other rock album from 1991, they sound very dated and sterile.

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These walls of texts :facepalm:

Which you can scroll past in about two seconds.... :facepalm:

 

 

 

Most of the good songs on the UYIs were noted to be ready years prior to the release of the albums, including Axl's parts. I don't see how you can pin the blame on Axl or any one person in the band. I think the main reasons for the wait were - 1. so that they could develop shit filler tracks and do the gimmick "double-album" release, and 2. the saturated production process. I think the main issue with those albums, from an objective standpoint, is the inclusion of tremendously awful, shit songs like So Fine and Get in the Ring. Sure, for some hardcore fans, it's better to have more songs than less, no matter how good they are, especially in hindsight considering that these would be the last original songs the classic lineup would release, but the truth remains that the songs are indeed shit and the UYIs would probably be looked at in a similar light to AFD had they trimmed the fat and released one album of only good songs. Imagine if AFD had been released in two parts, with each part being half real AFD songs and half filler shit like hair-metal covers, Shadow of Your Love and Ain't Goin' Down.

Regardless of the four year wait, GNR put out two phenomenal rock albums over that span of time. Unfortunately, one of those two was spread over its own two albums, but they still released two albums worth of top-notch material in two separate intervals.

Valid points.  The "big guns" were already being mentioned in 89 interviews such as Estranged(Without You at the time), NR of course, Coma, maybe Locomotive. We already knew about songs such as Don't Cry, YCBM,etc.

 

Even if an albums worth of songs was ready by that point, the massive success of AFD and Lies prevented it from even being considered, especially from a label standpoint. Why release a new GNR album when their two albums are still in the top 40?

 

I do get the point of fans wanting UYI earlier.....it would be UYI with the AFD lineup recording and releasing it and maybe Izzy isn't losing interest and being fazed out on that version.

 

The debate over condensing UYI into one strong album has been going on since the day after its release....and will continue.  The debate always hits the same brick wall.....what truly can be considered filler? I agree they were interested in making history with that album  and the sessions were certainly on the verge of scraping the bottom of the barrel quality wise. The recording of so many covers being recorded is proof of this.

 

You think So Fine is shit....yet I might include it if condensing UYI into one record. You hate Get In The Ring...so do I....yet some believe it contains some of Slash's best guitar work. Where do I/you/they draw the line?

 

You made a good point about it being that band's last album(s) so we needed as many songs as possible which is the main reason I wish TSI had been a bonus disc with UYI(or B sides to singles) containing the tracks finished during the UYI sessions with Izzy(DOTF, Attitude, New Rose, Black Leather, IDCAY). Instead we get TSI two years later with Izzy removed/Gilby added and the band is coasting on fumes at that point.

 

Funny you should mention Aint Going Down in that scenario because that song was on the original UYI track list that was released to Circus Magazine a month before UYI's release. There simply wasn't room on the albums for all the songs originally listed.

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