Sora

How many original members does a band need to be legitimate?

31 posts in this topic

Inspired by GN'R, I thought I'd ask this.

Almost every band out there has replaced a member or two in their history. The question is, how many original members have to remain for you to accept that band as still being the same band?

My example is The Rolling Stones. The original lineup of the Stones was Mick Jagger, Keith Richards, Brian Jones, Bill Wyman, and Charlie Watts. Brian quit and then then the lineup was Mick, Keith, Mick Taylor, Bill, and Charlie. That was still the Stones, just with a different musical approach. Then Taylor quit and the lineup was Mick, Keith, Ronnie Wood, Bill, and Charlie. Again, the Stones still but with a different musical approach. Then Bill quit and since then, it's only been Mick, Keith, Ronnie, and Charlie, with no official bassist. Of the original band only Mick, Keith and Charlie are the original memebrs. For me that's too little. When Bill left, it left a void and to me the Stones have been a hollow version of themselves since he quit. 

But then there's bands in which every member is equally important and if you remove one it'd change the whole band. I have never accepted Queen without Freddie because Queen to me was Freddie. Zeppelin could not have replaced John Bonham. The Who isn't The Who without Keith Moon. 

Then there's bands that replaced virtually every member and was successful. Black Sabbath has had numerous lineups wherein Tony Iommi was the only original member and it worked and was successful. Aerosmith's last non-Hair Metal record which was actually good was recorded when Joe Perry and Brad Whitford were gone.

So what about you? Where do you draw the line?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

They need to have the primary songwriters, they need to have the superstars, and they need to release original music.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, magisme said:

They need to have the primary songwriters, they need to have the superstars, and they need to release original music.


Here's the thing. Let's take this ball to the GN'R court for a minute. Let's say this reunion was Axl, Izzy, Duff and Steven plus say, Zakk Wylde or Brian May or someone like that in Slash's place. No Slash, but you have the two guys who wrote the bulk of the songs in the band. No superstar, but the bulk of the writing credits suggest Izzy was much more important than Slash. Would it be more GN'R if it was 4/5ths, just sans Slash?

I mean, did you know Keith Richards was looking at a 10 year rap in 1978 for Heroin? Mick Jagger had Mick Taylor on standby to replace him if Keith went to jail. You would've had a Keith-less Stones touring back in the late 70s. 

Or look at Rock in a Hard Place by Aerosmith. That's missing Perry and Whitford, but tell me those aren't the hardest rocking songs since Rocks on that record.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Miser said:


Here's the thing. Let's take this ball to the GN'R court for a minute. Let's say this reunion was Axl, Izzy, Duff and Steven plus say, Zakk Wylde or Brian May or someone like that in Slash's place. No Slash, but you have the two guys who wrote the bulk of the songs in the band. No superstar, but the bulk of the writing credits suggest Izzy was much more important than Slash. Would it be more GN'R if it was 4/5ths, just sans Slash?

I mean, did you know Keith Richards was looking at a 10 year rap in 1978 for Heroin? Mick Jagger had Mick Taylor on standby to replace him if Keith went to jail. You would've had a Keith-less Stones touring back in the late 70s. 

Or look at Rock in a Hard Place by Aerosmith. That's missing Perry and Whitford, but tell me those aren't the hardest rocking songs since Rocks on that record.

Nope. It's not GNR without Slash. It might be something interesting, and it's definitely something I'd check out, but it isn't GNR.

 

"Not GNR" is not an insult btw. It's just perceived as an insult by Axl and his insecure fanboys.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, magisme said:

Nope. It's not GNR without Slash. It might be something interesting, and it's definitely something I'd check out, but it isn't GNR.

 

"Not GNR" is not an insult btw. It's just perceived as an insult by Axl and his insecure fanboys.


I don't take it as an insult personally, but by others it is used as one. Perhaps not by yourself, but "not GN'R" usually tends to mean "automatically shite", you know? Personally, I was a huge Axl fanboy but as I've gotten older I realize he was a real flake and the real weak link in GN'R. Yeah, he was interesting, handsome and wrote some good lyrics, but for as much he helped them break through, he also held them back twice as much. 

Anyway, back on topic....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It all depends on the public perception as to who the face of the band is - and that public face having the ability to deliver the goods. 

 

With GNR the face is Axl and Slash. 

 

Sure Axl could just about deliver the goods without Slash but nobody accepted it as being "real GNR" 

 

Likewise the Stones are Mick and Keith. Lose either and it is over. 

 

Queen was Freddie

 

 

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Facekicker said:

It all depends on the public perception as to who the face of the band is - and that public face having the ability to deliver the goods. 

 

With GNR the face is Axl and Slash. 

 

Sure Axl could just about deliver the goods without Slash but nobody accepted it as being "real GNR" 

 

Likewise the Stones are Mick and Keith. Lose either and it is over. 

 

Queen was Freddie

 

 


Freddie is unmatched in the history of rock n' roll as a musician. Mick Jagger was IMO the best frontman in terms of stage presence but Freddie had it all - the man was a modern day genius. In the 80s Freddie was on par with Jagger in terms of commanding a stage. But Queen is the one band where I feel there's not a single poor album. Even their slagged records have SOMETHING great in there - cause of Freddie.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The one that's hoarding the salami is the only legit one

3 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, sixes said:

The one that's hoarding the salami is the only legit one

Like we said - Freddie :lol:

4 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In GN'R's case, only Dj ASHBA™ Presented By Rockstar Energy is needed. 

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
33 minutes ago, The Linguini Occurrence? said:

Majority of the originals.

 

When there's more replacements than originals, it ain't legit.


Define the ratios. For example, Stones are 3/6ths of their original members**

Or a more uneven ratio: GN'R. 3/5ths originals right now.

**= Ian Stewart was an official member, but was demoted to "unofficial member" by their manager because he didn't look the part.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, magisme said:

They need to have the primary songwriters, they need to have the superstars, and they need to release original music.

This.

 

 

It depends on the band also. Each situation is different.

 

On Soundgarden's last tour, Cameron had obligations to Pearl Jam so they brought in a replacement temporarily. It wasn't the same. If they try that on a permanent basis on their upcoming album/tour cycle(likely to be the last), they might as well not even bother...at least from a hardcore fan perspective.

 

 

 

 

The 80s hair bands that continue to stay afloat make me cringe. There are situations like with Britny Fox, Quiet Riot, etc. where its only one guy remaining and he had nothing to do with the band's success. It amazes me that anyone supports it but it probably works only because its very casual fans that buy tickets because they want to hear Cum on Feel the Noize while drinking a few beers.

 

Look at RATT. The drummer pulled an Axl somehow and got rights to the name. started a new lineup from scratch, went out on tour and called it RATT.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, sixes said:

The one that's hoarding the salami is the only legit one

One day qe wilk fight and murder each other. One with a salami stick, the other with a mighty hot dog

 

It is foretold 

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, hotdogman said:

One day qe wilk fight and murder each other. One with a salami stick, the other with a mighty hot dog

 

It is foretold 

 

I can think of nothing more noble than being killed by a processed meat

 

I await this glorious day

3 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1. November Rain

2. Look at Your Game Girl

3. Catcher in the Rye

4: Estranged

6. Bad Obsession

7. Crash Diet

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, sixes said:

 

I can think of nothing more noble than being killed by a processed meat

 

I await this glorious day

 

I will peel the skin from your flesh and bone, and with it, create the finest sausage. No man, woman, or chidld will be able to feast upon its unyielding glory 

4 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, hotdogman said:

 

I will peel the skin from your flesh and bone, and with it, create the finest sausage. No man, woman, or chidld will be able to feast upon its unyielding glory 

 

I may call upon my secret weapon, the liverwurst, to combat this assault. This delicious assault, but an assault nonetheless.

 

If I smell a scent of sauerkraut however, all rules of war shall be broken

3 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, sixes said:

 

I may call upon my secret weapon, the liverwurst, to combat this assault. This delicious assault, but an assault nonetheless.

 

If I smell a scent of sauerkraut however, all rules of war shall be broken

Liverwurst is a fine weapon, perhaps I will counter with a nice headcheese.

 

Saurkraut and ketchup are banned from war. I pray we will not use such heinous substances in the great battle to come.

 

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, hotdogman said:

Liverwurst is a fine weapon, perhaps I will counter with a nice headcheese.

 

Saurkraut and ketchup are banned from battle. I pray we will not use such heinous substances in the great battle to come.

 

 

Surely said headcheese will revolt and join my side but I do have my reservations about General olive loaf. He once wrapped his slippery skin around a hot link which caused a minor scandal. God only knows where his pimentos went. They were never found

 

Mustard will remain its neutral pussy self

3 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am a song of centuries

I whisper of worries wound within

Twist storries of unspoken secrets

I am a being of truth and treachery

Of such beauty and imperfection

Of processed meat and vegatable

I am the olive loaf

 

 

3 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Let us drink to the battles we've lived and we've fought 
Celebrate the pain and havoc we have wrought 
Great heroes charge into the fight 
From the north to the south in the black of night

The clash of honor calls to stand when others fall 
Gods of war feel the power of thy wurst

3 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Motörhead was only Lemmy, no one seemed to give a shit about that.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now